1 SUPERIOR COURT OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA
2 IN AND FOR THE COUNTY OF SANTA BARBARA
3 SANTA MARIA BRANCH; COOK STREET DIVISION
4 DEPARTMENT SM-2 HON. RODNEY S. MELVILLE, JUDGE
7 THE PEOPLE OF THE STATE OF )
8 CALIFORNIA, )
9 Plaintiff, )
10 -vs- ) No. 1133603
11 MICHAEL JOE JACKSON, )
12 Defendant. )
16 REPORTER’S TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS
18 TUESDAY, MARCH 1, 2005
20 8:30 A.M.
27 REPORTED MICHELE MATTSON McNEIL, RPR, CRR, CSR #3304
28 BY: Official Court Reporter 172
1 APPEARANCES OF COUNSEL:
3 For Plaintiff: THOMAS W. SNEDDON, JR.,
4 District Attorney -and-
5 RONALD J. ZONEN, Sr. Deputy District Attorney
6 -and- GORDON AUCHINCLOSS,
7 Sr. Deputy District Attorney -and-
8 GERALD McC. FRANKLIN, Sr. Deputy District Attorney
9 1112 Santa Barbara Street Santa Barbara, California 93101
13 For Defendant: COLLINS, MESEREAU, REDDOCK & YU BY: THOMAS A. MESEREAU, JR., ESQ.
14 -and- SUSAN C. YU, ESQ.
15 1875 Century Park East, Suite 700 Los Angeles, California 90067
17 SANGER & SWYSEN
18 BY: ROBERT M. SANGER, ESQ. 233 East Carrillo Street, Suite C
19 Santa Barbara, California 93101
21 OXMAN and JAROSCAK BY: R. BRIAN OXMAN, ESQ.
22 14126 East Rosecrans Boulevard Santa Fe Springs, California 90670
1 APPEARANCES OF COUNSEL (Continued):
2 For NBC-Universal; CBS Broadcasting Inc.; Fox News
3 Network, LLC; ABC, Inc.; Cable News Network, LP, LLP; The New York Times
Company; The Los Angeles
4 Times; USA Today; The Washington Post; and The Associated Press:
6 GIBSON, DUNN & CRUTCHER, LLP
7 BY: THEODORE J. BOUTROUS, JR., ESQ. 333 South Grand Avenue
8 Los Angeles, California 90071
1 Santa Maria, California
2 Tuesday, March 1, 2005
3 8:30 a.m.
5 THE COURT: Good morning.
6 COUNSEL AT COUNSEL TABLE: (In unison)
7 Good morning, Your Honor. Good morning.
8 THE COURT: Mr. Mesereau.
9 MR. MESEREAU: Thank you, Your Honor.
10 Good morning.
11 THE JURY: (In unison) Good morning.
12 MR. MESEREAU: Ladies and gentlemen of the
13 jury, I would like to clarify some statements I made
14 yesterday, correct a couple of statements, and talk
15 a little bit more about a few other things I
17 First of all, the prosecutor, in his opening
18 statement, made an allegation that Mr. Jackson had
19 intentionally, knowingly provided alcohol to a child
20 on a flight from Florida.
21 You will learn in the trial that on that
22 private flight were Mr. Jackson, two of his
23 children, his physician, security personnel, and
24 other guests, as well as the Arvizos. And you will
25 hear from his physician that he was in a seat on
26 that plane where he could see everything and never
27 slept. And he never saw anything like this
28 so-called licking that the prosecutor described. 175
1 But in that regard, you need to understand
2 that the charges in this case involving alcohol are
3 not charges like a bartender giving an underaged kid
4 alcohol. The charges are that Mr. Jackson gave
5 alcohol for the purpose of molesting.
6 The alcohol charge is directly tied into
7 allegations of molestation. One doesn’t exist
8 without the other in those alcohol charges. And
9 Mr. Jackson absolutely denies that.
10 In that regard, we will prove to you,
11 through witnesses, people who worked at and visited
12 Neverland, that the Arvizo kids, at times, were out
13 of control, broke into the wine cellar, were caught
14 drinking alcohol themselves, without Mr. Jackson
15 even being present or knowing about it. They also
16 were caught breaking into the refrigerator in the
17 kitchen, drinking alcohol, and they were caught
18 grabbing alcohol from a cupboard. There is one
19 witness who will tell that you Mr. Jackson ordered
20 some alcohol for he and guests and the children
21 stole it. They were caught intoxicated. They were
22 caught with bottles. Mr. Jackson was nowhere
24 We will prove to you that they are now
25 trying to say that he was behind all of this. And
26 it’s false.
27 We also will prove to you that the Arvizo
28 children, as I said before, initially seemed very 176
1 well behaved, but that changed. And it changed
2 radically. For example, there are workers who are
3 in charge of the amusement rides. There is a ferris
4 wheel. There are other carousels that children,
5 when they visit Neverland, ride on and play on.
6 One of the workers in charge of those rides
7 will tell you that he’s not sure how this happened,
8 but they appeared to have memorized the codes to
9 start those rides. And he was shocked and horrified
10 to find the kids on a ferris wheel up at the top
11 throwing objects at elephants and people.
12 They also, we will prove, did that with
13 various codes in the house. They somehow found a
14 way to roam around the house at will when Mr.
15 Jackson wasn’t even in town and were actually caught
16 in his room. Those witnesses will testify to those
17 facts. They were out of control.
18 The prosecutor told you that there were
19 girlie-type magazines and sexually explicit material
20 in Mr. Jackson’s home, and there were. Mr. Jackson
21 will freely admit that he does read girlie magazines
22 from time to time. And what he does is he sends
23 someone to the local market, and they pick up
24 Playboy and they pick up Hustler, and he has read
25 them from time to time. He absolutely denies
26 showing them to children. And, in fact, the
27 magazines the prosecutor referred to were in a
28 locked briefcase. And Mr. Jackson will tell you he 177
1 found those kids going through his magazines, and
2 grabbed them from him and locked them in his
3 briefcase. That will be proven at trial.
4 I want to emphasize that Mr. Jackson was
5 paid nothing from Bashir. The original negotiations
6 were that money would go to charities in England.
7 They were talking about 250,000 pounds, British
8 pounds they are.
9 That, from Mr. Jackson’s point of view, the
10 incentive for doing that documentary was that he
11 trusted Mr. Bashir was going to present him in an
12 appropriate and honorable and honest light. And
13 that’s not what happened.
14 Yesterday, I mentioned Mrs. Arvizo, while
15 she said she was falsely imprisoned, going for a
16 body wax treatment. I checked the receipt, and I
17 mistakenly said February 14th. It’s February 11th,
18 for the body wax. What is particularly significant
19 about that, other than the fact that it’s hard to
20 believe while you’re being falsely imprisoned you’re
21 going for a local body wax. The significance is
22 this: She, at her own request, was driven from
23 Neverland to a salon. She was gone for about three
24 hours. She was left at the salon alone. She was
25 there for over an hour getting a treatment, when she
26 says she was falsely imprisoned and couldn’t
27 communicate with anyone. That is the significance
28 and that is absurd. 178
1 On that particular day, some very odd things
2 happened. Her boyfriend and now her husband, as I
3 mentioned, was a Major Jay Jackson, who’s in the
4 Army Reserve, and he was making approximately $8,000
5 a month while she was accepting welfare. And he was
6 allowing her to deposit her welfare checks into his
7 account. And as I said to you yesterday, she was
8 not disclosing his income or support in any of her
9 requests for public assistance, which were under
11 On that particular day, Major Jackson spoke
12 to her on the phone, and something strange happened.
13 In between the body waxes and whatever else she was
14 doing at Neverland, she claims and he claims that
15 she said she had trouble at Neverland and that he
16 called 9-1-1. But when he told her that he had
17 called 9-1-1, she said, “I’m not having trouble. We
18 don’t need 9-1-1.” So the opportunity to call
19 9-1-1, to call the police, to call the military
20 police, was always there. She says she was kept
21 from these people during all of this false
22 imprisonment by some conspiracy she claims was
23 engineered by Michael Jackson. And that’s false.
24 On that note, we will prove to you, ladies
25 and gentlemen, that during the period she says she
26 was falsely imprisoned, she had access to the Los
27 Angeles Police Department, and was, in fact, in
28 contact with police officers in the Los Angeles 179
1 Police Department who she associated with, and never
2 raised an issue about false imprisonment. She was
3 in contact with Major Jay Jackson, who also had
4 access to the military police, and no complaint was
6 She went to a federal building in Los
7 Angeles to get a passport for the trip to Brazil.
8 That federal building was loaded with federal
9 employees, federal agents. Nobody was told there
10 was a problem.
11 She had access to the Department of Children
12 & Family Services in Los Angeles because they
13 interviewed her. Where. At Jay Jackson’s home.
14 Did she complain, “We’re being falsely imprisoned.
15 We’re being abducted. We’re being pressured. We’re
16 being defrauded. My children are at risk”. No,
18 All of this during the period that the
19 prosecutor says the family was being abducted,
20 falsely imprisoned, children were being harmed, et
22 I told you yesterday that Michael Jackson
23 flat out denies these molestation allegations. They
24 are false.
25 Now, the prosecutor told you that Ms. Arvizo
26 and her children will come in and say there was
27 molestation. They gave you this lurid discussion of
28 masturbation and things of that sort. Well, ladies 180
1 and gentlemen of the jury, the Santa Barbara
2 Sheriffs raided Neverland. Approximately 70
3 officers showed up --
4 MR. SNEDDON: Excuse me, Counsel. I’m going
5 to object as argumentative.
6 THE COURT: Sustained.
7 MR. MESEREAU: Ladies and gentlemen, the
8 Arvizo children’s DNA was never found in Mr.
9 Jackson’s bedroom after searching and testing.
10 Their DNA isn’t there. Because the molestation
11 claims are fiction.
12 I did mention yesterday that Mr. Jackson
13 owns approximately a million book. He does, but I
14 think I may have suggested that they were all in his
15 house. Actually, a lot of them are in storage. So
16 I want to make sure that’s clear. But he is a
17 voracious reader and book collector.
18 I also indicated to you that the prosecutors
19 initially had filed a Complaint against Mr. Jackson
20 alleging that molestation had occurred, based on
21 what the Arvizos told them before the Arvizos did
22 the rebuttal tape praising Michael Jackson saying he
23 never did anything wrong. And you’ll see it in the
24 trial. And also before they were interviewed by the
25 Los Angeles Department of Children & Family Services
26 where they repeated their absolute denials that he’d
27 ever done anything wrong. They did nothing but
28 praise him to the hilt. 181
1 And what I said to you was after the reality
2 of those statements set in, the prosecutors changed
3 the dates of the alleged molestation and now they’re
4 supposed to have occurred after those interviews.
5 And as I said to you, this is a time when
6 the media and Mr. Sneddon’s investigating, and
7 everybody is talking about this Bashir documentary,
8 and the networks are coming out to see if they can
9 vie for the ability to do a rebuttal tape. This is
10 when they’re claiming these acts of molestation
11 occurred. They didn’t.
12 Now, Mr. Sneddon, the prosecutor, said to
13 you, “Janet Arvizo doesn’t want money. She’s not
14 doing this for money.”
15 Well, we will prove to you the following:
16 As I said yesterday, when she allegedly learned of
17 these molestation claims, she didn’t go to the
18 police, she went to a lawyer. And I just mentioned
19 to you that she was in touch with various members of
20 the Los Angeles Police Department during this period
21 of so-called false imprisonment, this period of a
22 so-called conspiracy by Michael Jackson and his
24 One of those police officers will testify
25 that Janet said to him, “Something big is happening,
26 and I got a lawyer.” That’s number one.
27 Number two, as I said to you yesterday, she
28 realized at some point that going to a lawyer first 182
1 doesn’t look too good. And that’s when she began to
2 claim that she learned about it from the police, not
3 the lawyers. The problem is, that the lawyers are
4 the ones who eventually went to the police. So
5 you’ll have to figure that one out.
6 Janet Arvizo told the Santa Barbara Sheriffs
7 in one of her interviews, “You know, my kids have
8 till the age of 18 to file civil suits.” And she
9 was correct, because someone underage who has a
10 claim is not held to what is called a statute of
11 limitations the way adults are.
12 A statute of limitations, as many of you
13 know, is a certain period of time you have to sue if
14 you have a claim, or your claim gets stale. It gets
15 thrown out, because they don’t want -- basically the
16 law says that people can’t go sitting around forever
17 waiting to file claims, or the whole system would be
19 So the statutes of limitation have been
20 defined by the legislature. And they give time
21 periods during which somebody can sue.
22 For her children, the alleged victims of
23 molestation, they have till 18. And she told that
24 to the police, just as she told the police that she
25 had hired lawyers. Why did she tell that to the
26 police. And why in her police interviews, as we
27 will prove, did she repeatedly say, “I need money, I
28 want money,” or words to that effect. 183
1 Ladies and gentlemen, we will prove to you
2 the relationship between a criminal prosecution and
3 a civil claim for damages based upon the same type
4 of alleged conduct. What am I referring to. I
5 think some of you know this already, but we’re going
6 to prove it to you anyway.
7 Here’s what it is: There is what is called
8 a burden of proof in a criminal case; and that is,
9 you must prove beyond a reasonable doubt the
10 allegations are true and that the defendant’s
12 In a civil case what is called the burden of
13 proof is lighter. It’s easier. It’s called
14 preponderance of the evidence.
15 MR. SNEDDON: Your Honor, I’m going to
16 object to this.
17 THE COURT: Sustained.
18 MR. MESEREAU: Ladies and gentlemen, we will
19 prove that Janet and her children are using this
20 case to win a civil case.
21 MR. SNEDDON: Your Honor, I’m going to
22 object to that as argumentative.
23 THE COURT: Sustained.
24 MR. MESEREAU: We will also prove that her
25 lawyer, Larry Feldman, who the prosecutor
26 acknowledged had sued Mr. Jackson a long time ago, a
27 lawyer very well known in Beverly Hills, California,
28 we will prove to you that this lawyer was having 184
1 lunch with CNN talk show host Larry King and told
2 him, “She wants money.”
3 Ladies and gentlemen, the prosecutor
4 yesterday alleged that acts of molestation occurred
5 during certain dates. We will prove to you that
6 most of those dates, not all of them, but most of
7 them, Michael Jackson wasn’t even near Neverland.
8 Based upon our investigation, we can find four
9 approximate dates where he was at Neverland. But a
10 lot of the dates you heard the prosecutor identify,
11 he isn’t even near the place.
12 Now, ladies and gentlemen, I’d like to talk
13 to you a little bit about these conspiracy
14 allegations, particularly as they relate to the
15 so-called co-conspirators that Mr. Jackson is
16 supposed to be aligning with for the purpose of
17 committing felonies.
18 The first thing you need to know is what
19 they’re saying is that Mr. Jackson committed crimes
20 by agreeing with others to commit crimes, so-called
21 co-conspirators. And the prosecutor identified who
22 those co-conspirators are supposed to be. And
23 indeed, in the charging document, Judge Melville
24 read you their names. Schaffel, Dieter, Konitzer,
25 Cascio, Amen. You know that none of them have been
26 charged. Do you know that the only one they charged
27 with conspiracy is Michael Jackson.
28 MR. SNEDDON: Your Honor, I’m going to 185
1 object as argumentative.
2 THE COURT: Counsel, it is really -- the way
3 you’re saying what you’re saying is argumentative
4 form of -- you’re not saying, “We’re going to prove
5 this, we’re going to prove that.”
6 MR. MESEREAU: Okay. Thank you, Your Honor.
7 We will prove to you that none of those
8 so-called co-conspirators have been charged with any
9 crime. The only one these government prosecutors
10 have pointed out is Mr. Jackson when it comes to
11 these conspiracy allegations.
12 As I said to you yesterday, Mr. Jackson has
13 a certain lifestyle and presence that attracts all
14 kinds of people on a continual basis who seek to
15 profit at his expense. It’s an ongoing problem.
16 It’s an ongoing issue. He is one of the world’s
17 best known megastars. He’s known as a musical
18 genius, one of the greatest in the world. And he’s
19 known around the world as someone who’s made lots of
20 money. This is the reputation people come to him
21 with and they want to profit from it.
22 And you can just guess at the characters who
23 show up trying to get their nose under the tent with
24 an idea. An idea for a concert --
25 MR. SNEDDON: Your Honor, I’m going to
26 object again as argumentative.
27 MR. MESEREAU: I will -- I will change that,
28 Your Honor. 186
1 THE COURT: Rephrase it.
2 MR. MESEREAU: We will prove to you that
3 Mr. Jackson, because of his presence around the
4 world in the music industry, continually attracts
5 people who seek to profit.
6 We will prove to you, ladies and gentlemen,
7 that this creates a problem in his life. And here
8 is the problem we’ll prove to you exists: Mr.
9 Jackson is an artist. That is what his primary work
10 is. He’s an artist. He is called a musical genius.
11 He is a creative person who dances to a creative
13 Mr. Jackson was interviewed by Mr. Bashir
14 about how he lives, how he feels, and how he works.
15 And among other things, he responded to Mr. Bashir’s
16 questions along those lines. He said, “I have to be
17 inspired. I can’t wake up each day and say, ‘You
18 know, today I have a goal. I’m going to create
19 music. I’m going to create choreography. I’m going
20 to create a video. I’m going to find the message.
21 I’m going to translate it into music and
22 choreography. This is what I’m going to do today.’”
23 He told Mr. Bashir, “I can’t do that.
24 That’s not the way it works. I have to be inspired.
25 I don’t know when I’m going to be inspired. I have
26 to make myself open for inspiration in order to do
27 the kind of work I do.” And to do that, he has to
28 live a certain way. 187
1 For example, Mr. Bashir expressed surprise
2 when he said to him, “I have a tree on my property.
3 And lots of times I go up and I sit in the tree
4 alone. And I’m peaceful and I’m still, and I
5 meditate. And very often God gives me that creative
6 spark that I need to do the work that I excel in.”
7 We will prove to you that Mr. Jackson will
8 often wake up at 3:00 in the morning at Neverland.
9 He will walk out of his house alone, and he will
10 take a walk alone under the stars, under the moon,
11 under the sky. He will meditate in his own way, and
12 wait for ideas and inspiration to come.
13 And he often says when it comes to dance or
14 music, “I can’t think my way to the result. It has
15 to come to me, and I have to feel it.”
16 This is his lifestyle, we will prove. And
17 one of the problems, we will prove, is that if
18 you’re going to be that kind of a creative genius,
19 it doesn’t always leave time to sit down with
20 lawyers and accountants and business advisors on a
21 regular basis. In fact, he has said, “When I spend
22 time in those areas, I create less.”
23 What does that mean, ladies and gentlemen.
24 It means he’s vulnerable to being taken advantage of
25 financially and legally. And we will have witnesses
26 tell you, they have observed him presented with
27 documents, and he signs them without reading them.
28 And these types of behavior -- this type of behavior 188
1 has caused problems in the past for him. But he is
2 the creative spirit he is, and he has to live the
3 way he lives. And he doesn’t live like a criminal,
4 as they have told you.
5 At one point, a number of individuals
6 approached him, were able to actually get face to
7 face with him and convince him that they could help
8 him out with his affairs. Of course, this has been
9 going on for years. This has been going on, we will
10 prove to you, since he was a child. Because he
11 began performing at the age of five. And by the age
12 of eight was being recognized for his genius and his
13 talent. That’s an early age.
14 And he was, and his family, were working
15 with studios like Motown, where they got a big
16 break. And as part of the business of music, they
17 were told, “We have publicists, press people,
18 agents, managers. They will tell you what to say.
19 Image is business. Image is critical. You can’t
20 just walk out there and freely discuss your
21 feelings, your life, what you do, what you like or
22 don’t like. We’ll tell you what to say, and you’ll
23 say it.”
24 And things like personal habits, personal
25 fears, personal idiosyncrasies, were hidden,
26 because, after all, this was big business.
27 You heard the names Konitzer and Dieter.
28 They did arrive, and they did claim they were going 189
1 to somehow rescue Michael Jackson from this world of
2 charlatans and profiteers, and would-be do-gooders
3 with a hand in his pocket.
4 They also revealed who they were during the
5 course of his experience with them. The prosecutor
6 would have you believe that Mr. Jackson was somehow
7 involved with these people on a daily basis, getting
8 all kinds of information from them and knew
9 everything they were doing. He did not.
10 MR. SNEDDON: Your Honor, I’m going to
11 object as argumentative.
12 THE COURT: Overruled.
13 MR. MESEREAU: He didn’t. This is what
14 Dieter and Konitzer were planning to do with regard
15 to Mr. Jackson: Now, as for his involvement,
16 referring to Michael Jackson, Michael is an
17 entertainer and not a businessman. He does not like
18 business. He does not care about any formalities,
19 proper procedures, detailed briefings, et cetera.
20 Any one of those elements kills his creative energy.
21 He wants to stay out of that. That is the reason
22 why he gave us an extensive power of attorney.
23 Do you know what a power of attorney is,
24 ladies and gentlemen. I’m sure some of you do.
25 Maybe you all do. It’s giving away to somebody an
26 ability to sign for your affairs and represent you
27 in signing things and doing things from a legal
28 point of view. It’s a very serious act when you 190
1 give someone a power of attorney. But they got one
2 out of Michael.
3 They said further, “His intention was
4 definitely not being bothered with signatures here
5 and there, every other day, and with personal
6 meetings with each and every member of the team. We
7 realized that some might feel insulted, but it’s not
8 personal. Signatures and meetings with Michael
9 will, in general, not happen. Only in very special
10 cases, exceptions will be made.”
11 We will prove to you that these so-called
12 business advisors made a concerted effort to keep
13 Michael Jackson away from a lot of what they were
14 trying to do on his behalf and to control his
15 affairs, particularly the music business.
16 On January 11th, 2003, this is what one of
17 them wrote: “Yes, I and Mr. Weizner, whom you met
18 in Las Vegas, are authorized to engage you. We
19 shall gain control of financial affairs, records,
20 documents, agreements, and also operations, anything
21 else belonging to Michael Jackson in their
22 possession or control.”
23 They identified two phases of activity they
24 were going to pursue: One, take-over. Two, cleanup
25 operation, clean up old business. And they said
26 they were going to create what they called “The
27 Michael Jackson Universe.” This was their business
28 proposal for managing and controlling all of Michael 191
1 Jackson’s business, while he spent his time creating
2 and writing and choreographing and the things he
3 loves to do.
4 We will prove to you that, unlike what you
5 were told, he didn’t know a lot of things they were
6 doing, because they intended that he not know what
7 they were doing. And they weren’t telling him a lot
8 of what was going on.
9 We will also prove to you that a lawyer
10 named David LeGrand was, at one time, retained to
11 help Mr. Jackson. David LeGrand had been a
12 securities law prosecutor. As a securities law
13 prosecutor, we will prove that he had prosecuted
14 people for financial crimes, stock fraud, not
15 following proper procedures and disclosures if
16 you’re selling stock or securities. Things of that
18 David LeGrand began to smell that something
19 was wrong, and he confronted Dieter and Konitzer
20 with his suspicions, even writing to them and
21 saying, “Why are you withdrawing money. Who told
22 you to do that. Who gave you permission. Where’s
23 it going. What are you doing with it.”
24 They then were able to convince Michael
25 Jackson to fire LeGrand. But before that happened,
26 David LeGrand commenced an investigation into the
27 activities of these alleged co-conspirators, Dieter,
28 Konitzer, Schaffel and others. He hired a 192
1 top-flight investigative firm in New York to check
2 out their backgrounds, to check out what they were
3 doing, to see if they were hiding things overseas,
4 to see if Mr. Jackson was being, as he said,
5 defrauded, and to see if they were engaging in acts
6 as what he described as self-dealing.
7 But they were able to get to Michael and
8 stop the investigation by getting him to fire
9 LeGrand, because they convinced him that LeGrand was
10 doing something wrong.
11 An investigative report was prepared. It
12 wasn’t completed, but it was prepared. It was
13 printed and it was given to Mr. LeGrand.
14 Marc Schaffel, the prosecutor told you that
15 Mr. Jackson was a partner in his business. We will
16 prove to you he was never a partner in his business.
17 Marc Schaffel was a film producer who had met Mr.
18 Jackson in the early ‘90s. And at one point Mr.
19 Jackson said he wanted nothing to do with him. That
20 was in writing from his attorneys.
21 Marc Schaffel, like so many others, wanted
22 to do business with Mr. Jackson. And typically, as
23 we will prove, when people are on the outs, they
24 band with other people on the outs and look for a
25 way to get back in. They look for a way to glom
26 onto somebody who has Mr. Jackson’s ear during the
27 limited time he has to deal with these things. And
28 Mr. Schaffel came forward with a proposal that a 193
1 rebuttal show be done with FOX.
2 Mr. Schaffel travels to Brazil all the time.
3 Mr. Schaffel has friends in Brazil and production
4 facilities in Brazil. And Mr. Schaffel convinced
5 Janet Arvizo that she should come to Brazil, because
6 Michael Jackson was going to be with them in Brazil.
7 And she was all for it. We will produce witnesses
8 who will tell you that Janet Arvizo was very excited
9 about going to Brazil. Her children, apparently,
10 weren’t excited, because they wanted to stay at
12 But we will prove to you through witness
13 testimony that she was very happy about going to
14 Brazil until she concluded that Schaffel and Dieter
15 and Konitzer and others were somehow trying to
16 profit off Michael Jackson and keep her out of the
17 profits. That’s when all these new claims began to
19 And when she decided not to go to Brazil,
20 she didn’t go to Brazil. When she decided not to go
21 to Brazil, Marc Schaffel went to Brazil anyway.
22 Because that’s where he was planning to go all
24 We will produce witnesses who will tell you
25 that she was excited about this vacation. She
26 thought she was going to be with Michael Jackson.
27 And one of the constant themes I’ve been
28 articulating to you is that when she realized 194
1 Michael wasn’t going to be there taking care of the
2 family the rest of their life, her attitude suddenly
3 changed. And when she realized she couldn’t make
4 millions of dollars one way, she looked for another
5 way. And here we are.
6 I was going through a chronological
7 description yesterday of events, and we were into
8 February of 2003. I told you that the Bashir
9 program had aired in the United States on February
10 6th, 2003. I also told you, ladies and gentlemen,
11 we would prove that that’s the day that Prosecutor
12 Sneddon announced he was investigating. And
13 according to this prosecutor, a little over a month
14 after he starts investigating, and Michael Jackson
15 learns about it, he suddenly begins to molest. It’s
16 false and absurd.
17 I told you that two days later, on February
18 8th, 2003, Ed Bradley at 60 Minutes arrived at
19 Neverland with his film crew. Also present was the
20 president of CBS Entertainment, Jack Sussman;
21 Attorney David LeGrand, whom I just mentioned to
22 you, the one who began investigating the backgrounds
23 and the activities of these alleged co-conspirators;
24 and Attorney Mark Geragos.
25 Now, Attorney Mark Geragos you’ve heard
26 about because he’s been in some high-profile cases
27 in California. And he had been contacted by
28 Mr. LeGrand because Mr. Sneddon had started an 195
1 investigation. He was at Neverland that day also.
2 That’s February 8th.
3 On February 13th, Janet Arvizo has a phone
4 conversation with Frank Cascio that is recorded,
5 without her knowledge. And I’d like to tell you a
6 few of the things she said in that phone
7 conversation February 13th.
8 She didn’t like those German people, she
9 said, and of course she was referring to Dieter and
10 Konitzer. She said to Frank Cascio, “I love you so
11 much. You don’t know how much I love you. Your
12 little sister and your little brother.”
13 Janet Arvizo: “Yeah, it’s like we’re
14 family, you know, Frank.”
15 Frank tells her, “And to protect Michael,
16 because we’ve been in this situation many times,
17 Janet. And you know what, it ends up hurting the
18 kids, and we don’t want -- and Michael does not want
19 Gavin to be hurt.”
20 Janet, as I said yesterday, has been
21 complaining that the media are harassing her. And
22 that her son, who was in the Bashir documentary, is
23 being hassled at school. She has requested security
24 help and she has gotten it. We will prove to you
25 now she has converted all of this into this notion
26 of being imprisoned.
27 Janet: “Oh, I know, I know. That’s why I’m
28 getting all those information. Oh, for example, 196
1 ahh, there was like a year and a half ago, a year
2 and a half ago they did an investigation of me and
3 David.” David, of course, is her ex-husband.
4 “We understand that Michael Jackson and
5 Chris Tucker are involved with you and the kids.”
6 And they said -- and the kids spoke up and
7 they said, “They’re family to us. If we didn’t have
8 Michael, if we didn’t have Michael, we wouldn’t have
9 a father, a father figure in our life.”
10 And then the social worker, referring to the
11 Department of Children & Family Services: “Okay.
12 I’ll give the person here a call. Name, David
13 Arvizo. And she documented it and everything. So
14 I’m returning the note paper so you can have all
15 these papers.”
16 She continually says, “Michael is our
17 father.” Ladies and gentlemen, Michael Jackson will
18 tell you one time at Neverland he got a very bad
19 feeling and intuition. They were in the theater
20 that you’ve heard about. There is a theater at
21 Neverland, where you can just go in, and kids can
22 have their seats. It’s on an incline. You got a
23 stage and you got a big screen.
24 He was there with Janet Arvizo and the three
25 kids, Gavin, Star and Davallin. And all of a
26 sudden, Janet Arvizo grabs Michael’s hand and has
27 her children all hold hands, and she says, “Let’s
28 all kneel down and pray with our Daddy Michael.” 197
1 And Michael Jackson got a very bad feeling.
2 And after that, he concluded, “I got to get away. I
3 got to get away. I love helping this child, but
4 something is wrong.”
5 And we will prove to you that he was warned
6 by others, “Get away.”
7 Janet Arvizo continues in that recorded
8 phone conversation, “I know we’re family, Frank.
9 Me -- you, me, my kids, are family. You, Marie
10 Nicole, my kids, Baby Rubba, are family. Michael,
11 Marie Nicole, you, me, are family, and my parents,
12 that’s all I got.”
13 “So that’s why these German people” -- and
14 it’s inaudible what she says, but presumably it’s
15 not too kind.
16 She is sensing that Dieter and Konitzer, the
17 ones who wanted to take over Michael’s business, are
18 keeping her away from Michael, the daddy figure, the
19 one who’s supposed to rescue her family from all of
20 their troubles.
21 Further on, she says to Frank Cascio, “So
22 he’s -- I told him, I told the German people, ‘But
23 you don’t understand. He’s family to us and we’re
24 family to him.’ And oh, ahh...”
25 And he goes, “Your kids are unimportant, you
27 “Michael’s family to me. My kids call him
28 ‘Daddy Michael’.” 198
1 Yesterday the prosecutor told you he would
2 prove that Michael wanted this. Nonsense.
3 Frank Cascio: “Michael wants to see you.”
4 Janet Arvizo: “Tell him he’s our family.”
5 Frank Cascio: “You don’t have to talk to
7 Janet Arvizo: “I thought, like everything,
8 my family was in jeopardy.”
9 Frank Cascio: “No.”
10 Janet Arvizo: “Meaning us being with
11 Michael and Michael being with us.”
12 She fears that relationship is ending.
13 Ladies and gentlemen, we will prove that
14 three days later, the Arvizo family are interviewed
15 by Brad Miller, a licensed California investigator,
16 employed by Attorney Mark Geragos.
17 Now, Mr. Geragos at this point was concerned
18 about who the Arvizos were, and what they were up
19 to, and what they really were trying to accomplish.
20 During this period of alleged false
21 imprisonment, the investigator visits them at their
22 home. Does Major Jay Jackson of the Army Reserve
23 call the police.
24 No. They have an interview with the
25 investigator that is tape-recorded. Again, three
26 days after that phone conversation with Frank was
27 recorded and she didn’t know it was being recorded.
28 Okay. 199
1 She starts talking about her son’s cancer.
2 Janet Arvizo: “To this day it’s an unknown
3 cancer. And it’s been declared that by multiple
4 laboratories and a team of 12 doctors.”
5 And she talks about her son’s internal
6 organs that have been removed. Left adrenal,
7 kidney, tip of his pancreas, spleen, lymph nodes, et
9 The investigator says to her, “Okay. Thank
10 you. And what was Mr. Jackson’s role in his
12 Janet Arvizo: “Like a -- like a father to
14 Investigator: “What would Michael do.”
15 Janet Arvizo: “Everything a loving
16 father -- unselfish, kind” - inaudible - then
17 “exhibits unconditional love.”
18 She goes on: “And that’s one thing the
19 role Michael was -- there’s not -- he wasn’t just a
20 father figure to Gavin, he also was to Star and
21 Davallin, because he knew all three of them needed
22 him. And he was, um, is family to me and he also
23 realized that I needed him.”
24 This is when she’s living with her
25 boyfriend, whom she later married.
26 Janet Arvizo - we go on further - “Yes, and
27 all -- David’s role - her ex-husband - to make sure
28 he appeared to be a good father to people, because 200
1 he knows of the harm that he placed on me and my
2 children for years.”
3 “How long were you married to David.”
4 “17 years. I’m living -- we’re legally
5 separated, pending divorce.”
6 And then she talks about her being the
7 victim of domestic violence by the ex-husband.
8 I remind you, in the J.C. Penney deposition,
9 she said he had never touched her, under oath.
10 She talks about her ex-husband committing
11 acts of child endangerment and terrorist threats.
12 Sound familiar.
13 Then Gavin says about his father, “He hit me
14 while I -- during my cancer treatment. Even when I
15 had surgery, he hit me a lot.”
16 Star Arvizo: “He used to hit me in the head
17 a lot and used to always kick me.”
18 Davallin: “He would throw us against the
19 wall and he would yank us by the hair.”
20 Davallin: “My mom has bald spots resulting
21 from my father.”
22 Then Janet talks about how he would abuse
23 their dog and their pet ferret.
24 Continuing with Janet Arvizo in this
25 conversation that she knew was recorded: “No, I’m
26 just a regular person, Brad. I had to live with him
27 for 17 years. And for 17 years I wished that one
28 day me and my children were going to be delivered 201
1 from this evil. And when Michael came into the
2 picture, I knew that Michael was kind and gentle and
3 a loving person, and he too had to be delivered from
5 Continuing; Janet Arvizo: “Yes, he went --
6 they had filmed. When they had filmed the beautiful
7 story about Michael and my son, David was there,
9 That’s the Bashir filming. “And he no
10 longer allowed me to be around Michael because he
11 was afraid that I was going to tell Michael about
12 everything. Everything that the children had --
13 were undergoing by his -- his -- I don’t know how to
14 classify it -- evil demonic ways.”
15 She calls the ex-husband demonic. Didn’t
16 Mr. Sneddon tell you that she refers to Michael as
17 “the devil”.
18 Continuing in this interview; Janet Arvizo:
19 “And that one day the kids and me were going to tell
20 Michael. So only one time I went with David up
21 there when he was the -- and me and Michael were
22 dancing. Just dancing. We were approximately --
23 maybe like 20 feet from each other and we were
24 dancing to the same song. And when I -- and when we
25 were taken back into that room, that’s why the rest
26 of the trip Michael never saw me again. I was
27 beaten up.” She says she was beaten up inside the
28 guest room by her ex-husband at Neverland. 202
1 Were police called. No. Were complaints
2 made. No. Did anyone hear about it. No. Were
3 security yards contacted at Neverland. No. Kitchen
4 staff, zookeeper, management, administration, fire
5 truck operator. No.
6 “And me, because I knew that Michael was
7 going to help us. I knew he was going to protect
8 us, as any loving father would, as any head of
9 household. Because that’s how I see Michael, as a
10 family man. He’s a family man.”
11 The investigator looks at Gavin, and he
12 says, “Gavin, tell me about when you would spend the
13 night with Michael. Where would you sleep.”
14 “I spent the night with Michael one time
15 when he slept on the floor.”
16 He says his brother and he slept on
17 Michael’s bed. Michael slept on the floor. And
18 “Michael slept on the floor. Michael slept on the
20 “When I had cancer, he would sleep on the
21 floor. And my brother would be there with me.”
22 “Was there ever anything inappropriate with
24 Janet: “Never.”
25 Davallin, the sister, says the following:
26 “He’s a bigger father to all of us. He’s given us
27 safety. He’s given us love. He’s given us
28 everything we’ve ever wanted. He’s been our father 203
1 figure. He’s the only thing we know to be a
3 Michael Jackson is being sucked in. And
4 look what happens when you try to sever the
5 connection and not take responsibility for this
6 family for the rest of your life, after you were
7 kind enough to help them when they were in need.
8 Janet Arvizo: “And being what I endured for
9 17 years, I would be the most sensitive to any
10 little thing. And Michael has never, absolutely
11 never made me feel, in any way, form or shape or
12 matter, that anything was different, other than
13 Gavin, as a son to Michael, Star as a son to
14 Michael, Davallin as a daughter to Michael. And
15 Michael father, like a father to all three of them.
16 And to me, family. We, my kids and me, no
17 rejection. We know neglection. We’ve been
18 rejected, neglected, spit on, fried, tried, burned,
19 abused, the door shut in our face, opportunities
20 lost. And Michael said -- took us from way behind
21 in the line and pulled us up to the front, and said,
22 “You matter to me. You may not matter to many
23 people, but you matter to me. And that’s what’s
25 The prosecutor wants you to think this was
26 all scripted and done through force at the Major’s
27 home. The Major in the United States Army.
28 Janet talks a little bit about her life, 204
1 ladies and gentlemen. That obviously is going to be
2 an issue in this courtroom. She says David, her
3 ex-husband’s older brother, is a convicted drug
4 dealer. She says she would get beatings “because I
5 wouldn’t participate in drug activities or drug
6 sales. I got beat up for things I stood for.”
7 Always leading up to “Michael has rescued us
8 from destruction. We are his family. He is
9 responsible for us.”
10 As I mentioned to you, that was February
11 16th, 2003, three days after the recorded phone
13 Now we go to February 20th, four days later.
14 We will prove to you that Janet and the kids did a
15 video, freely, voluntarily; they wanted it. The
16 kids wanted to be on camera. They wanted to be
17 actors. The mother wanted to be on camera. The
18 hitch was they wanted lots of money.
19 They arrived at the home of the videographer
20 in Los Angeles. We will produce witnesses who will
21 tell you that Janet seemed happy as a lark, excited
22 and interested; but delayed it so she could talk to
23 someone whom she thought was an attorney. She
24 didn’t want to sign a document releasing rights.
25 She wanted rights. She wanted money if they were
26 going to be filmed. So they went through a lot of
27 discussion like that.
28 No false imprisonment, no abduction. No 205
1 force. Nothing like that.
2 She was laughing and giggling throughout the
3 video, as you will see. You will see her laughing
4 during the filming. And you will see her laughing
5 with her kids when they think they’re not being
7 She goes through the same routine I just
8 read to you. The same victim routine. “We were
9 spat on because of our race, our poverty. Nobody
10 would help us. We shared cereal. We were going
11 nowhere,” words to that effect. “And Daddy Michael
12 rescued us. Took us into his fold, became the
13 surrogate father.” And they all praise him to the
14 hilt. This is February 20th. They praise him for
15 all he has done to help Gavin with his illness.
16 They praise him for all he has done to help them
17 enjoy life. But implicit in everything she says is,
18 “We are now his family. He is now our dad.”
19 Again, while she’s living with Major Jay
20 Jackson of the United States Army. Again, she says,
21 this is all part of the false imprisonment. And as
22 I said to you yesterday, when you see this tape -
23 and if they don’t show you, we will - just watch the
24 responses. Watch the facial expressions. Watch the
25 spontaneity in the Arvizos. Watch Davallin shed
26 tears about wonderful Michael is. Watch Gavin
27 praise him for being a father figure; and say to
28 yourself, “Is this whole family rehearsed because 206
1 there’s a gun to their head.” Absolutely,
2 positively no.
3 She does bring religion in; I’ll tell you
4 that. She says that, “God’s grace as God works
5 through people, so does the devil. But God elected
6 to work in Michael to breathe life into Gavin and to
7 my two other children, and to me a much necessary
8 love in a very traumatic time in our life.” On, and
9 on, and on.
10 The next morning, she’s interviewed by the
11 Los Angeles Department of Children & Family
12 Services. Now, the prosecutor told you that this
13 was all under the gun too, because there was some
14 security guy imprisoning them or stopping their
15 movement or stopping them from calling someone on a
16 telephone. Did they ever tell the interviewers from
17 the Los Angeles Department of Children & Family
18 Services, “We’re being held against our will, my
19 children are being abducted, I’m being falsely
20 imprisoned, we are prisoners of Michael Jackson”.
21 No. They sang his praises again.
22 And you know something. Actor Chris Tucker,
23 from the Rush Hour Series, girlfriend was there too.
24 Did they ever look at her and, say, “Please, sneak a
25 call to the police. Call 9-1-1. Do something.
26 Help us. We’re being restricted”.
28 After they realized the effect of these 207
1 interviews, after they realized it might be a tough
2 sell, that this is all scripted and done by force,
3 that’s when the dates of the alleged molestation
4 changed to after these interviews. Gavin has said
5 to the police on one occasion it was before the DCFS
6 interview, and then changed it to it was after. How
8 How come.
9 The day after those interviews, Ms. Arvizo
10 went to a lawyer named William Dickerman. She had
11 concluded that she had been duped by Schaffel,
12 Dieter, Konitzer, Frank, Vinnie. She had concluded
13 she was not going to get a piece of the action from
14 any rebuttal show, which, as you know, was supposed
15 to be a response to the Bashir documentary.
16 And as I said to you yesterday, yes, there
17 was concern over Michael being placed in a false
18 light, and Bashir. But also these people saw great
19 money-making opportunities, because you could do
20 another show and the networks were bidding for the
21 other show.
22 She decided she wasn’t going to be able to
23 obtain what she wanted and now it was time to take
24 legal action. She had the lawyer send a series of
25 letters to Geragos. And they started coming. First
26 of all, she was upset that she was joined with
27 Michael as a complainant, a plaintiff in a British
28 lawsuit against the company that produced the Bashir 208
1 documentary. Because as I said to you yesterday, we
2 will prove Michael was duped by Bashir, didn’t want
3 his children revealed so you could recognize them on
4 the show, thought he had editorial control, and
5 trusted Bashir.
6 Janet claimed to be upset that her son was
7 on the show. In reality, we’ll prove, she wanted
8 money from the show. That was the problem. She had
9 joined Michael Jackson in a suit in England with
10 Michael Jackson paying the fees. And it was done
11 through LeGrand, his lawyer who I mentioned before,
12 who had obtained legal counsel in England.
13 She decided, “I’m not going to get much out
14 of any of this.” So she went to this lawyer and he
15 starts writing letters to Mr. Geragos, saying she
16 wants her property back, which is in storage.
17 At her request, her property was taken from
18 the studio apartment, put in storage. Her back rent
19 was paid by these people who were helping her out,
20 because she wanted to go to Brazil, and she always
21 complained, “I want to live in a nicer place.”
22 In fact, her daughter stated to one witness,
23 “We’re going to get a nice home in the Hollywood
24 Hills.” Her fiance and now husband complained, “We
25 want more than a house out of this. We want more
26 than a college education out of this. You guys are
27 making millions. What are we getting.”
28 She wanted out of that location. What she 209
1 decided to do when she thought she couldn’t make
2 money the friendly way was to make money through
3 lawyers the hostile way. And Dickerman started
4 sending letters, “We want her furniture back, we
5 want her possessions back,” as if Michael Jackson
6 wanted to steal her furniture and possessions. But
7 nevertheless, he also said, “We don’t want Mr.
8 Jackson’s people hassling her, harassing her.
9 Interestingly enough, the letters keep
10 coming, and there’s never any mention of child
11 molestation. Not in any of these letters.
12 Those claims evolved with time.
13 In late March, Janet Arvizo bumped into one
14 of the Department of Children & Family Services
15 workers who had interviewed her at a hamburger
16 place, late March 2003. Never mentioned sexual
17 misconduct, false imprisonment, extortion, child
18 abduction, giving alcohol to minors for sexual
19 purposes. Never mentions any of this stuff. Sees
20 her at a public place.
21 March 26th, Lawyer Dickerman contacts Mark
22 Geragos and never mentions sexual misconduct. It’s
23 in April of 2003 that Janet Arvizo goes to Lawyer
24 Larry Feldman.
25 On April 16th of 2003, the Santa Barbara
26 Sheriff’s Department closes their case investigating
27 Michael Jackson. They conclude no criminal activity
28 has gone on. 210
1 In May of 2003, that’s May 15th, Larry
2 Feldman, who, as you know, has sued Michael Jackson
3 before, gets Janet and the children to talk to a
4 psychologist that he uses as an expert witness in
5 other cases. In other words, lawyers often will
6 have experts they want to use and the experts get
7 paid, and they’re kind of in bed together.
8 Not until May 29th, 2003, does this
9 psychologist suddenly claim he has a reasonable
10 suspicion there was molestation. I repeat the date.
11 May 29th, 2003. She hires Attorney Feldman in
12 April. It’s not till the very end of May that they
13 come up with these false claims.
14 On June 5th, 2003, the psychologist meets
15 with Lawyer Feldman and Lawyer Dickerman. They’re
16 all collaborating. Doesn’t go to the police. Janet
17 doesn’t go to the police. The kids don’t go to the
19 Psychologist Katz and Lawyer Feldman go to
20 the Los Angeles Department of Children & Family
21 Services on June 13th to report this.
22 I’d like you to hear this one, ladies and
23 gentlemen: On September 30th, 2003, Lieutenant
24 Klapakis from the Santa Barbara Sheriff’s Office
25 calls the Los Angeles Department of Children &
26 Family Services and doesn’t want them to interview
27 the Arvizos. I repeat, doesn’t want them to
28 interview the Arvizos. They already had. 211
1 On March 29th, 2004, Janet Arvizo testifies
2 under oath before a grand jury in Santa Barbara and
3 says she learned for the first time about the
4 molestation from the police. That, we will prove,
5 is false.
6 Ladies and gentlemen, it’s going to be a
7 long trial and you’re going to see and hear lots of
8 evidence. We are extremely confident that, when you
9 do, you are going to find Michael Jackson absolutely
10 not guilty of any of this.
11 Thank you. `
12 THE COURT: Thank you, Mesereau.
13 MR. MESEREAU: Thank you, Your Honor.
14 THE COURT: We’ll take our morning recess.
15 Remember the admonition.
16 (Recess taken.)
1 (An off-the-record discussion was held in
3 THE COURT: All right. Is there a
4 stipulation reached.
5 MR. SNEDDON: Yes, Your Honor, between
7 MR. SANGER: Yes, Your Honor.
8 THE COURT: Would you state, briefly state
9 the stipulation.
10 MR. SNEDDON: Yes, Your Honor. The
11 stipulation is that there are certain exhibits
12 lodged with the Court in connection with the grand
13 jury proceedings, and there’s a stipulation that
14 those exhibits can be released to us, to the People,
15 and that -- for mutual use by both sides.
16 MR. SANGER: So stipulated, Your Honor.
17 THE COURT: I’ll approve that stipulation
18 and release the exhibits.
19 MR. SNEDDON: Thank you, Your Honor.
20 THE COURT: Leslie, is the unit on here. Is
21 this on.
22 THE BAILIFF: You need to --
23 THE COURT: No, I just asked if the --
24 THE BAILIFF: It takes about ten seconds to
25 heat up.
26 THE COURT: You may call your first witness.
27 MR. SNEDDON: Thank you, Your Honor. Call
28 Martin Bashir. 213
1 Mr. Bashir, come forward, please.
2 THE COURT: Come forward to the witness
3 stand. And when you get to the witness stand,
4 remain standing, face the clerk here, raise your
5 right hand.
7 MARTIN BASHIR
8 Having been sworn, testified as follows:
10 THE WITNESS: I do.
11 THE CLERK: Please be seated. State and
12 spell your name for the record.
13 THE WITNESS: My name is Martin Bashir.
14 M-a-r-t-i-n; surname, B-a-s, as in “sugar,” h-i-r.
16 DIRECT EXAMINATION
17 BY MR. SNEDDON:
18 Q. Mr. Bashir, I’m going to ask you if you’d
19 scoot a little closer to that microphone, if you
21 A. I’m not particularly tall. I’m sorry.
22 Q. That’s all right.
23 Mr. Bashir, what is your profession or
25 A. I’m a television journalist.
26 Q. And how long have you been involved in that
28 A. I’ve been involved in journalism for 20 214
1 years, and I’ve been a television journalist for
2 around 18 years.
3 Q. Could you just --
4 THE COURT: Somehow you need to get closer to
5 that mike. Can you swing it towards you a little
7 BAILIFF CORTEZ: It’s bolted down.
8 THE COURT: It moves this way.
9 THE WITNESS: I’m sorry.
10 THE COURT: Okay.
11 THE WITNESS: Sorry.
12 THE COURT: You’ll have to move to it. It
13 doesn’t --
14 THE WITNESS: I’m sorry. I’ve been working
15 as a journalist for 20 years, and I’ve been working
16 as a television journalist for around 18 years.
17 Q. BY MR. SNEDDON: Tell us a little bit, to
18 the ladies and gentlemen of the jury, if you would,
19 a little bit about what a television journalist
21 A. A television journalist is somebody who
22 performs the task of journalism, which is, in
23 effect, to report, to research, to investigate, to
24 report stories. The distinction would be that a
25 television journalist, as opposed to a newspaper
26 journalist, would use the medium of television so
27 that -- when I started my career, I would write for
28 newspapers, do stories for newspapers, did some 215
1 sports reporting, some general news. And then when
2 I moved on to television, it was the same core task
3 of reporting, but it was done using the medium of
5 Q. And then how does the profession -- how does
6 the way that you practice that profession differ, if
7 it does in any respect, from those that we see on
8 the nightly network news stations reporting the news
9 as a journalist.
10 A. There would be no distinction as to what I’m
11 doing. I’m covering stories and reporting. I
12 suppose the distinction would be that news
13 journalists would tend to file shorter reports.
14 My career has tended to be fixed around
15 long-form films. I mean by that documentaries,
16 half-hour, one-hour, and in some cases two-hour
17 films, current affairs programs. So I would tend to
18 be described in the United Kingdom as a current
19 affairs specialist, somebody who does long-form film
20 as opposed to nightly news.
21 Q. Now, in the practice of your profession,
22 where is it that you’ve worked professionally.
23 A. As a television journalist.
24 Q. Yes, sir.
25 A. I began at the BBC with what we call
26 regional broadcasting. That would be like a local
27 affiliate to you.
28 Q. Now, what is the BBC. 216
1 A. The BBC is the British Broadcasting
2 Corporation. It is a state-funded broadcasting
3 organization which does everything from drama,
4 comedy, to news and current affairs, light
5 entertainment, music, and I joined a local regional
6 station in London covering news that was breaking in
7 London. I did that for three years.
8 Then after that, I was promoted to a network
9 position on a current affairs program called “Public
10 Eye.” And there I did a variety of domestic
11 stories, everything ranging from car crime, to
12 stories about violent attacks and racist attacks on
13 immigrant groups in London.
14 After that -- I did that for about three
15 years, and then after that I moved on to a program
16 called “Panorama,” and that was in 1992. “Panorama”
17 is the BBC’s flagship current affairs program. And
18 whilst on that program, I did a number of important
19 stories, and the first film I did for “Panorama” was
20 actually a film about allegations of satanic abuse.
21 I did a film which investigated whether there was
22 such a thing. There was so-called satanic covens --
23 MR. MESEREAU: Objection. Narrative.
24 THE COURT: Sustained.
25 Q. BY MR. SNEDDON: In the year of 2002 --
26 excuse me just a second.
27 (Brief interruption.)
28 Q. BY MR. SNEDDON: All right, Mr. Bashir, 217
1 let’s jump forward in your career to the year 2002,
2 if we could.
3 A. Sure.
4 Q. Where were you employed professionally in
5 the year 2002.
6 A. I was employed by the United Kingdom’s
7 biggest commercial television network ITV.
8 Q. And what does “ITV” stand for.
9 A. Independent Television.
10 Q. And in connection with your professional
11 responsibilities there, did you do video
13 A. What do you mean by “video documentaries”.
14 Q. All right. Then obviously you didn’t, if
15 you don’t know what it’s called.
16 When you do programs, what do you call them.
17 A. I call them films.
18 Q. Films.
19 A. Yeah. Current affairs films.
20 Q. Current affairs films, so we can talk about
21 the same thing.
22 Now, could you give me just two or three or
23 maybe four, just by name, of individuals that you’ve
24 done current affairs films for over the years.
25 A. Sure. I did a one-hour special on a
26 notorious serial killer called Harold Shipman, who
27 is alleged to have murdered 273 people and was found
28 guilty in court and in fact committed suicide quite 218
1 recently. I did an hour on that.
2 I did a special hour on an extraordinary
3 story featuring a Maltese couple who came to the
4 United Kingdom, and the mother was --
5 MR. MESEREAU: Objection. Relevance.
6 THE COURT: The qualifications is overruled.
7 Q. BY MR. SNEDDON: Did you do a current
8 affairs piece on Princess Diana.
9 A. I did, yeah. That was not in 2002. That
10 was in 1995.
11 Q. All right. So you did do that.
12 A. I did.
13 Q. And how long was that production.
14 A. I think the total duration was around an
15 hour and 50 minutes, an hour and 45 minutes.
16 Q. All right. Now, in connection with your
17 current affairs occupation or business during the
18 year 2000, did you do a current affairs film on the
19 defendant in this case, Michael Jackson.
20 A. I did.
21 Q. And could you tell me when it was that you
22 commenced that, in what year.
23 A. 2002.
24 Q. And when did you finish it.
25 A. The broadcast date was the 3rd of February,
27 Q. When did you actually complete the project,
28 the filming of it. 219
1 A. The filming of it, I think the last day of
2 filming was the 14th of January, 2003, in Miami.
3 Q. Now, during the time -- and you have -- let
4 me ask you this: Did you review the actual film
5 that was used in connection with the broadcast you
6 just mentioned in Great Britain.
7 A. I’m sorry, what do you mean, did I “review”
9 Q. The one that was shown on the television.
10 Excuse me, let me just go back for a second if we
12 What was the name of the program in which
13 the current affairs film on the defendant in this
14 case, Mr. Jackson, was shown in the United Kingdom.
15 A. It was titled, “Living with Michael
17 Q. And what program was it connected with.
18 Some individual program, or just --
19 A. It was made by a team. The current affairs
20 team that supplied the weekly output for ITV was
21 called “Tonight.” The show was called “Tonight.”
22 Q. That’s what I was after, what the show was
24 A. Forgive me, I’m sorry. The program itself,
25 because it was longer than a normal “Tonight” show,
26 was actually broadcast on a different night in the
27 evening for a longer duration, so it was given its
28 own specific title for that reason. 220
1 MR. SNEDDON: All right. Your Honor, at
2 this time I have two exhibits I’d like to have
3 marked as People’s 1 and People’s 2 for
4 identification purposes.
5 Actually, if you would excuse me, I will
6 make my way over to the clerk.
7 (Off-the-record discussion held at counsel
9 MR. SNEDDON: Your Honor, the exhibits that
10 I’ve just had the clerk mark for identification
11 purposes, People’s 1 is a custodian of the records
12 declaration from a Phillip Lunt, L-u-n-t, from
13 Granada Productions as the declarant, as the
15 And the second exhibit is the -- I’m opening
16 the package and removing from it the film. That’s
17 been marked as People’s Exhibit No. 2, which
18 according to the authentication, is a copy of the
19 program that was shown in Great Britain on February
20 the 3rd, so I’d like to have both of these moved
21 into evidence as People’s 1 and 2, and I intend to
22 then show the video to the jury.
23 THE COURT: All right. They’re admitted.
24 Q. BY MR. SNEDDON: Mr. Bashir, one last
25 question before we actually show the video.
26 During the time that you were in production
27 of the video “Living with Michael Jackson,” were you
28 aware of the fact that Mr. Jackson also had one of 221
1 his videographers accompanying you during the
2 filming of your footage.
3 MR. BOUTROUS: Objection.
4 Your Honor, I should probably introduce
5 myself. I’m Mr. Bashir’s counsel, Theodore J.
6 Boutrous, Jr., and I’m joined here today by Henry
7 Hoberman, who is a senior vice-president and the
8 head of litigation for ABC News, and pursuant to the
9 Court’s prior order, I’m going to object to this
10 question on the grounds that it calls for
11 unpublished information that’s protected by the
12 California Constitution’s journalist shield law
13 which is meant to protect the independence of
14 journalists from being called to testify.
15 And I’d like to renew our objection to Mr.
16 Bashir being called today and also would rely on the
17 First Amendment, First Amendment privilege for
19 Thank you, Your Honor.
20 THE COURT: Mr. Boutrous, the objection you
21 raise, it’s not a privilege. It’s a shield from
22 contempt. So from the standpoint of sustaining your
23 objection, I won’t sustain the objection.
24 The question’s been asked. Are you going to
25 answer the question.
26 MR. BOUTROUS: Your Honor, the First
27 Amendment privilege is a privilege, so I would
28 request that the Court enforce that privilege. This 222